Avodah Mailing List

Volume 32: Number 92

Mon, 02 Jun 2014

• 1. "Ba'asher hu shom", or "Kol hamerachem al ho'achzorim"? (Zev Sero)
• 2. Re: "Ba'asher hu shom", or "Kol hamerachem al ho'achzorim"? (Micha Berger)
• 3. Re: army service, females (Zev Sero)
• 4. Re: army service, females (Micha Berger)
• 5. Re: Kzayit (Micha Berger)
• 6. Re: army service, females (Zev Sero)
• 7. Mitzvah leFarneis (Micha Berger)
• 8. Re: Mitzvah leFarneis (Prof. Levine)
• 9. Eating Dairy on Shavuos (Prof. Levine)
• 10. Birchos Ha-Shachar on Shavuos Morning by Rabbi D. Neustadt (Prof. Levine)
• 11. "For God shall bring every work into judgment concerning every hidden thing, whether it be good or whether it be evil" ()
• 12. Corrected Birchos Ha-Shachar on Shavuos Morning by Rabbi D. Neustadt (Prof. Levine)

[This is form an Areivim discussion.

To provide context:

>> On 5/28/2014 11:28 PM, Zev Sero via Areivim wrote:
>>> http://www.firstworldwar.com/features/tandey.htm

> On 29/05/2014 9:16 AM, Lisa Liel wrote:
>> The latter.

On 5/29/2014 8:23 AM, Zev Sero via Areivim wrote:
> Why?
>
> In particular, what made him a known achzor at that time?  Merely that 
> he was wearing the enemy uniform?

To which Lisa replied:
>> Tov she'ba-goyim b'she'at milchama harog.  The concept is generalizable, 
>> I think.  The other side in a war is the enemy.

Zev 5/29 8:23 cont:
> What made the other side achzorim?  AFAIK they
> weren't any crueller than his own side, or than soldiers generally are 
> in war.

And more of Lisa's reply is in the quote chain below.

-micha]

On 29/05/2014 11:06 AM, Lisa Liel wrote:
> On 5/29/2014 9:31 AM, Zev Sero via Areivim wrote:
>> On 29/05/2014 10:29 AM, Lisa Liel wrote:
>>> True. But it's all hindsight at this point. And knowing what we do
>>> now, he was an achzar. If I had a time machine and could go back and
>>> kill him, I don't see why it would be inappropriate to do so.

>> What about "ba'asher hu shom"?

> That's for Hashem.  Has nothing to do with us.

On the contrary, it makes more sense to say that if Hashem, to Whom
there's no real difference between future and past, doesn't judge someone
for what he has not yet done, then how much more so we, to whom the
difference is real, mustn't do so, even if we are somehow certain that
the person will offend.

OTOH we have ben sorer umoreh.  But even he has to have committed an actual
crime.

-- 
Zev Sero
z...@sero.name

Hashem judges people, the "Bochein kelayos valeiv" is the only One capable
of accurately assessing the "hu" of "ba'asher hu sham". (Which is why
I find the lemaalah min hateva aspect of teshuvah to be its possibility,
not that it actually changes judgment. One recreates the self, of course
the judgment changes.) Human beings can only judge actions. Without
mindreading, it's a poor approximation.

So why is BD called upon to judge?

- To dissuade people from committing crime by making punishment more tangible
  than gehenom.
- To protect society from repeat offence. Someone who was antisocial or
  destructive to the community's raison d'etre in the past is more likely
  to do so again.
- To help the chotei acheive kapparah.
etc...

Hashem's judgment is different than ours in a second way. It is equally
valid to speak of Hashem's response to sin as to speak of the consequences
of sin. The difference is merely the "when" we assign to HQBH deciding
to punish -- after the cheit, or when He designed metaphysics. But since
He has no "when", it's all a matter of perspective.

So when can equally say that the damaged soul, "ba'asher hu sham",
gets onesh the same way a diseased body gets pain. And even that the
given act is deemed a cheit is because it causes such destruction, and
Hashem's tzivui is akin to a doctor's orders. (IOW it is both true that
we are punished for violating Hashem's command as it is true that Hashem
commanded us to avoid activities that He knows causes suffering.)

But we? We repay action with action.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             Today is the 44th day, which is
mi...@aishdas.org        6 weeks and 2 days in/toward the omer.
http://www.aishdas.org   Gevurah sheb'Malchus: What type of justice
Fax: (270) 514-1507                            does unity demand?

On 29/05/2014 1:05 PM, saul newman via Avodah wrote:
> http://www.jpost
> .com/Defense/Rabbinical-association-says-permissible-in-Jewish-law-for
> -women-to-enlist-to-IDF-354648



> The Beit Hillel rabbis also leveled criticism at the Chief Rabbinate,
> saying that while its position had not changed, society in general,
> including the national-religious community, had changed.

And therefore the halacha should change?!

-- 
Zev Sero             Sufficiently advanced incompetence is indistinguishable
z...@sero.name        from malice.
                                                          - Eric Raymond

On Thu, May 29, 2014 at 05:02:26PM -0400, Zev Sero via Avodah wrote:
:> The Beit Hillel rabbis also leveled criticism at the Chief Rabbinate,
:> saying that while its position had not changed, society in general,
:> including the national-religious community, had changed.

: And therefore the halacha should change?!

Arguably keli gever is a matter of societal norm, and if it's no
longer abnormal for women to serve (and on Memorial Day I heard a
lot of gender-equal terminology for US service-people), perhaps
there is no issue.

The arayos issue is certainly one of umdena.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

On Wed, Apr 30, 2014 at 03:18:54PM -0400, Micha Berger wrote:
: The AhS (OC 16:4) says that a tallis qatan needs to be at least 3/4 of
: an ammah sq in front and behind the person, and he tells us that this
: is 9 vershoks in then Russian units. Meaning an ammah = 12 vershok =
: 53.34 cm (wikipedia provided conversion for vershok).

AhS OC 90:4 says that 4 amos is 3 arshin (which is also 1 sazhen)
1 arshin = 71.12 cm
1 ammah = 3/4 * 71.12 cm = 53.34 cm

So the math is tight, not approximate.

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

On 29/05/2014 5:43 PM, Micha Berger wrote:
> Arguably keli gever is a matter of societal norm

 From my recollection of the sources, it seems that this aspect of keli gever
does *not* depend on societal norms, it's dictated by halacha for all time.
But I may not be recalling correctly, or there may be other opinions.  At any
rate, though, without further explanation "society changing" is not a reason
for halacha to change, and the quoted statement seems clearly based on the
premise that it is.

-- 
Zev Sero             Sufficiently advanced incompetence is indistinguishable
z...@sero.name        from malice.
                                                          - Eric Raymond

AhS OC 90:20 has another confirm of the AhS's ammah when he equates a
mil to a Russian versta ("turn" of a plough). But that's not why I'm
writing...

He writes:
    ...
    And it is obvious that a person shouldn't wake up early to go on
    his way for a devar reshus from a city that has a shul, even to go
    before the light of morning. And which we are not careful in this,
    it is because WE GO ON THE ROAD FOR OUR PARNASOS. THIS IS CONSIDERED A
    DEVAR MITZVAH [emph added], for it is a mitzvah to support [lefarneis]
    his wife and children. For there is an obligation to support his wife;
    and his sons and daughter -- about this Chazal said that it is said
    "oseih tzedqaah behol eis -- [enriched are those who keep mishpat,]
    those who do tzedaqah at all times." (Kesuvos 50a [citing Tehillim
    106:3], and so it sounds like from MQ begining of the third chapter,
    see there.)

    And more: that this is davqa when he is able to reach his desired
    destination when it is still day, as it is written in SA se'if
    17.

So we hold halakhah lemaaseh that one can miss minyan to fit a work
schedule because supporting one's family is the greater mitzvah.

:-)BBii!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger             Today is the 45th day, which is
mi...@aishdas.org        6 weeks and 3 days in/toward the omer.
http://www.aishdas.org   Tifferes sheb'Malchus: What is the beauty of
Fax: (270) 514-1507               unity (on all levels of relationship)?

At 02:16 PM 5/30/2014, Micha Berger wrote:
>So we hold halakhah lemaaseh that one can miss minyan to fit a work
>schedule because supporting one's family is the greater mitzvah.

I think an even more important deduction from this is that one is 
supposed to work to support one's family!

YL
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See the discussion at

http://tinyurl.com/lctdl6c


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The widespread custom of staying awake the first 
night of Shavuos to study Torah presents a 
halachic problem - what to do about four of the 
morning blessings, Birchos ha-shachar, which 
cannot be recited unless one slept during the 
night. The other sixteen blessings may be recited 
as usual(1), but the following four blessings present a problem:

AL NETILAS YADAYIM - The Rishonim offer two basic 
reasons for the Talmudic law(2) of washing our 
hands in the morning and then reciting the proper 
blessing: The Rosh tells us that washing is 
necessary because a person's hands move around in 
his sleep and will inevitably touch some unclean 
part of the body. The Rashba says that since each 
one of us becomes a biryah chadashah - a "new 
person" - each morning, we must sanctify 
ourselves anew in preparation to serve Hashem. 
This sanctification is similar to that of a kohen 
who washes his hands before performing the avodah 
in the Beis ha-Mikdash. [In addition to these two 
reasons, there is still another reason for 
washing one's hands in the morning - because of 
ruach ra'ah, the spirit of impurity that rests on 
one's body at night and does not leave the hands 
until water is poured over them three times3. 
Indeed, touching various limbs or organs of the 
body is prohibited before hand-washing, due to 
the danger which is caused by the spirit of 
impurity(4). This third reason alone, however, is 
insufficient to warrant a blessing(5), since a 
blessing is never recited on an act which is 
performed in order to ward off danger(6).]

Does one who remains awake all night long need to 
wash his hands in the morning? If we follow the 
Rosh's reason, then washing is not necessary, for 
as long as one remains awake he knows that his 
hands remained clean. If we follow the Rashba's 
reason, however, washing may be required, since 
in the morning one becomes a "new person," 
whether he slept or not(7). [In addition, it is 
debatable if the spirit of impurity that rests on 
the hands is caused by the nighttime hours - 
regardless of whether or not one slept or if it 
rests upon the hands only during sleep.(8)]

Since this issue remains unresolved, the Rama 
suggests a compromise:-washing is indeed 
required, as the Rashba holds, but a blessing is 
not recited, in deference to the view of the 
Rosh. Not all the poskim agree with the Rama's 
compromise. In their view, the blessing should be 
recited(9). Since we again face a difference of 
opinion, it is recommended that one of the 
following options be exercised: Immediately after 
alos amud ha-shachar, one should relieve himself 
and then wash his hands, followed by Al netilas 
yadayim and Asher yatzar. In this case, all 
poskim agree that washing is required and a 
blessing is recited(10). This is the preferred 
option. One should listen - with intent to be 
yotzei -as another person, who did sleep, recites the blessing.

BIRCHOS Ha-TORAH - The poskim debate whether one 
who remains awake the entire night(11) is 
required to recite Birchos ha-Torah the next 
morning. Some authorities do not require it, 
since they hold that the previous day's blessings 
are still valid. In their view, unless a major 
interruption - such as a night's sleep - occurs, 
yesterday's blessings remain in effect. Others 
hold that Birchos ha-Torah must be said each 
morning regardless of whether or not one slept, 
similar to all other Birchos ha-shachar which are 
said in the morning, whether one slept or not. 
According to the Mishnah Berurah(12), this issue 
remains unresolved and the following options are 
recommended: One should listen - with intent to 
be yotzei - as another person, who did sleep, 
recites the blessing. This should be followed by 
each person reciting yevorechecha and eilu 
devarim, so that the blessings are followed immediately by some Torah learning.

While reciting the second blessing before Kerias 
Shema -Ahavah Rabbah -one should have the 
intention to be yotzei Birchos ha-Torah as well. 
In this case, he must learn some Torah 
immediately after Shemoneh Esrei. There are two 
other options available: The poskim agree that if 
one slept (at least half an hour) during the day 
of erev Shavuos, he may recite Birchos ha-Torah 
on Shavuos morning even though he did not sleep 
at all during the night(13). While reciting 
Birchos ha-Torah on erev Shavuos, one may clearly 
stipulate that his blessings should be in effect 
only until the next morning. In this case, he may 
recite the blessings on Shavuos morning although he did not sleep(14).

IN ACTUAL PRACTICE, WHAT SHOULD WE DO?

As stated earlier, all poskim agree that the 
other sixteen morning blessings may be recited by 
one who did not sleep at all during the night. 
Nevertheless, it has become customary in some 
shuls that one who slept recites all twenty 
morning blessings for the benefit of all those 
who did not sleep. Two details must be clarified 
concerning this practice: Sometimes it is 
difficult to clearly hear every word of the 
blessing being recited. [Missing one word can 
sometimes invalidate the blessing.] If that 
happens, it is important to remember that sixteen 
of the twenty blessings may be recited by each 
individual whether he slept or not, as outlined above.

The sixteen blessings which may be recited by 
each individual should not be heard from another 
person unless a minyan is present. This is since 
some poskim hold that the obligation of Birchos 
ha-shachar is discharged only by hearing them 
from another person in the presence of a minyan(17).

FOOTNOTES:
1 Rama O.C. 46:8.
2 Berachos 15a and 60b.
3 The source for the "spirit of impurity" is the 
Talmud (Shabbos 108b; Yoma 77b) and the Zohar, quoted by the Beis Yosef O.C. 4.
4 O.C. 4:3.
5 Mishnah Berurah 4:8.
6 Aruch ha-Shulchan 4:4 based on Rambam, Hilchos Berachos 6:2.
7 The rationale for this is: 1) Lo pelug, which 
means that once the Sages ordained that washing 
the hands is necessary because one is considered 
a "new person", they did not differentiate 
between an individual who slept and one who did 
not (Beis Yosef quoted by Mishnah Berurah 4:28); 
2) The blessing was established to reflect 
chiddush ha-olam, which means that since the 
"world" as a whole is renewed each morning, it is 
incumbent upon the individual to sanctify himself 
and prepare to serve Hashem each morning; whether 
he, personally, was "renewed" is immaterial 
(Beiur Halachah quoting the Rashba).
8 Mishnah Berurah 4:28.
9 Ruling of Aruch ha-Shulchan 4:12.
10 Mishnah Berurah 4:30 and Beiur Halachah 494:1. 
This should be done immediately after alos amud 
ha-shachar in order to remove the spirit of impurity; O.C. 4:14.
11 Even one who falls asleep during his learning 
[while leaning on a shtender or a table, etc.] 
does not say Birchos ha-Torah upon awakening; Kaf ha-Chayim 47:27.
12 47:28. Many other poskim, though, rule that 
Birchos ha-Torah may be said even by one who did 
not sleep at all; see Birkei Yosef 46:12; 
Shulchan Aruch Harav 47:7; Aruch ha-Shulchan 47:23; Kaf ha-Chayim 47:26.
13 R' Akiva Eiger quoted by Mishnah Berurah 
47:28. Harav C. Kanievsky, however, reports that 
the Chazon Ish did not agree with this ruling 
(Ishei Yisrael Hilchos Tefillah, pg. 719).
14 Keren L'David 59 and Luach Eretz Yisrael 
quoting the Aderes (quoted in Piskei Teshuvos O.C. 494:6).
15 46:24. This is also the ruling of Chayei Adam 
8:9 and Kitzur Shulchan Aruch 7:5.
16 Shulchan Aruch Harav 46:7; Kaf ha-Chayim 
46:49; Aruch ha-Shulchan 46:13; Misgeres ha-Shulchan 2:2.
17 Mishnah Berurah 6:14. In addition, see Kisvei 
Harav Henkin 2:7, who maintains that since many 
of the blessings are written in the first person, 
they must be recited by each individual; 
listening to them being recited by another person is not adequate.


D'Var Torah (1,2,3) and D'var Halacha? are 
courtesy of Torah.Org/Project Genesis - reprinted 
with permission which is gratefully acknowledged


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On the first day of Shavuot, Wednesday, the following is read from the Torah:
Sh?mot 19:19 ?The sound of the shofar grew continually much stronger, Moses
spoke (y?daber) and God answered him (ya?anenu) by a voice.? The whole scene
is mystical but what is even more curious is that the Hebrew uses the future tense.
??Moses WILL speak and God WILL answer?? This made me think of the book of
Kohelet which speaks about the hopelessness of life and ironically is read on one of the 
most joyous festivals of Succot. From this Book, Ernest Hemingway, got the title of his book,
?The Sun Also Rises.? Only at Kohelet?s very end does it say that if we attach ourselves to
God and religion, then life will have meaning. Apparently, Hemingway never read the end of
Kohelet because he tragically committed suicide. What is the connection to Moses WILL speak
and God WILL answer? Life seems to have little or no meaning, even after the Torah was given.
However, by fearing God and keeping His commandments, Moses WILL speak and God WILL 
answer, even though it seems like an eternity before it happens. 

Hope springs eternal in the human breast;
Man never is, but always to be blessed:
The soul, uneasy and confined from home,
Rests and expatiates in a life to come.
 Alexander Pope, An Essay on Man

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Part of this discussion was inadvertently left out.

 From http://www.torah.org/advanced/weekly-halacha/5757/bamidbar.html




BIRCHOS HASHACHAR ON SHAVUOS MORNING

The widespread custom of staying awake the first night of Shavuos to 
study Torah presents an halachic problem - what to do about four of 
the morning blessings, Birchos Hashachar, which cannot be recited 
unless one slept during the night. The other sixteen blessings may be 
recited as usual(1), but the following four blessings present a problem:

AL NETILAS YADAYIM - The Rishonim offer two basic reasons for the 
Talmudic law(2) of washing our hands in the morning and then reciting 
the proper blessing:

The Rosh tells us that washing is necessary because a person's hands 
move around in his sleep and will inevitably touch some unclean part 
of the body.

The Rashba says that since each one of us becomes a biryah chadashah, 
a "new person" each morning, we must sanctify ourselves anew in 
preparation to serve Hashem. This sanctification is similar to a 
kohen's who washes his hands before performing the avodah in the bais 
Hamikdash. =

[In addition to these two reasons, there is still another reason for 
washing one's hands in the morning - because of ruach raah, the 
"spirit of impurity" that rests on one's body at night and does not 
leave the hands until water is poured over them three times(3). 
Indeed, touching various body limbs or organs of the body is 
prohibited before hand-washing due to the "danger" which is brought 
about by the "spirit of impurity" (4). This third reason alone, 
however, is insufficient to warrant a blessing(5), since a blessing 
is never recited on an act which is performed in order to ward off danger(6).]

Does one who remains awake all night long need to wash his hands in 
the morning? If we follow the Rosh's reason, then washing is not 
necessary, for as long as one remains awake he knows that his hands 
remained clean. If we follow the Rashba's reason, however, washing 
may be required, since in the morning one becomes a "new person" 
whether he slept or not(7). [In addition, it is debatable if the 
"spirit of impurity" that rests on the hands is caused by the 
nighttime hours - regardless of whether or not one slept - or if it 
only rests upon the hands during sleep.(8)]

Since this issue remains unresolved, the Rama suggests a compromise - 
washing is indeed required, as the Rashba holds, but a blessing is 
not recited, in deference to the view of the Rosh. Not all the poskim 
agree with the Rama's compromise. In their view, the blessing should 
be recited(9). Since we again face a difference of opinions, it is 
recommended that one of the following options be exercised:

    * Immediately after alos amud hashacher, one should relieve 
himself and then wash his hands followed by Al Netilas Yadayim and 
Asher Yotzar. In this case, all poskim agree that washing is required 
and a blessing is recited(10). This is the preferred option.
    * Listen - with intent to be yotzei - as another person, who did 
sleep, recites the blessing. =

BIRCHOS HATORAH - The poskim debate whether one who remains awake the 
entire night(11) is required to recite Birchos Hatorah the next 
morning. Some authorities do not require it, since they hold that the 
previous day's blessings are still valid. In their view, unless a 
major interruption - such as a night's sleep - occurs, yesterday's 
blessings remain in effect.. Others hold that Birchos Hatorah must be 
said each morning regardless of whether or not one slept, similar to 
all other Birchos Hashachar which are said in the morning whether one 
slept or not. According to the Mishnah Berurah(12), this issue 
remains unresolved and the following options are recommended:

    * Listen - with intent to be yotzei - as another person, who did 
sleep, recites the blessing. This should be followed by each person 
reciting yevorechecha and eilu devarim, so that the blessings are 
followed immediately by some Torah learning.
    * While reciting the second blessing before Krias Shema - Ahavah 
Rabbah, one should have the intention to be yotzei Birchos Hatorah as 
well. In this case, he needs to learn some Torah immediately after 
Shmoneh Esrei.

There are two other options available:

All poskim agree that if one slept (at least one half hour) during 
the day of Erev Shavuos he may recite Birchos Hatorah on Shavuos 
morning even though he did not sleep at all during the night(13);

While reciting Birchos Hatorah on Erev Shavuos, one may clearly 
stipulate that his blessings should be in effect only until the next 
morning. In this case, he may recite the blessings on Shavuos morning 
although he did not sleep(14).

If one did not avail himself of any of these options and Birchos 
Hatorah were not recited, one may recite Birchos Hatorah upon 
awakening from his sleep on Shavuos morning (after davening). =

ELOKAI NESHAMAH AND HA'MAAVIR SHEINA - Here, too there are 
differences of opinion among the poskim whether one who remains awake 
throughout the night should recite these blessings. Mishnah Berurah 
(15) rules that it is best to hear these blessings from another 
person who slept. If no such person is available, many poskim rule 
that these blessings may be recited even by one who did not sleep(16).

In actual practice, what should we do?

As stated earlier, all poskim agree that the other sixteen morning 
blessings may be recited by one who did not sleep at all during the 
night. Nevertheless, it has become customary in some shuls that one 
who slept recites all twenty morning blessings for the benefit of all 
those who did not sleep. Two details must be clarified concerning 
this practice:

Sometimes it is difficult to clearly hear every word of the blessing 
being recited. (Missing one word can sometimes invalidate the 
blessing). If that happens, it is important to remember that sixteen 
of the twenty blessings may be recited by each individual whether he 
slept or not, as outlined above.

The sixteen blessings which may be recited by each individual should 
not be heard from another person unless a minyan is present. This is 
because some poskim hold that one cannot discharge his obligation of 
Birchos Hashachar by hearing them from another person unless a minyan 
is present(17).

----------


FOOTNOTES

1. Rama OC 46:8.

2. Brachos 15a and 60b.

3. The source for the "spirit of impurity" is the Talmud (Shabbos 
108b; Yuma 77b) and the Zohar, quoted by the Bais Yosef OC 4. =

4. OC 4:3.

5. Mishnah Berurah 4:8. =

6. Aruch Hashulchan 4:4 based on Rambam Hilchos Brachos 6:2.

7. The rationale for this is: 1) Lo plug, which means that once the 
Sages ordained that washing the hands is necessary because one is 
considered a "new person", they did not differentiate between the 
individual who slept or one who did not (Bais Yosef quoted by Mishnah 
Berurah 4:28); 2) The blessing was established to reflect chiddush 
ha'olam, which means that since the "world" as a whole is renewed 
each morning, it is incumbent upon the individual to sanctify himself 
and prepare to serve Hashem each morning - whether he, personally, 
was "renewed" is immaterial (Biur Halachah quoting the Rashba).

8. Mishnah Berurah 4:28.

9. Aruch Hashulchan 4:12 rules like this view.

10. Mishnah Berurah 4:30 and Biur Halachah; 494:1. This should be 
done immediately after alos amud hashachar in order to remove the 
"spirit of impurity" - OC 4:14.

11. Even one who falls asleep during his learning [while leaning on a 
shtender or a table, etc.] dose not say Birchos Hatorah upon 
awakening - Kaf Hachayim 47:27.

12. 47:28. Many other poskim, though, rule that Birchos Hatorah may 
be said even by one who did not sleep at all - see Birkei Yosef 
46:12; Shulchan Aruch Harav 47:7; Aruch Hashulchan 47:23; Kaf Hachayim 47:26.

13. R' Akiva Eiger quoted by Mishnah Berurah 47:28.

14. Keren L'Dovid 59 and Luach Eretz Yisroel quoting the Aderet 
(quoted in Piskei Teshuvos OC 494:6).

15. 46:24. This is also the ruling of Chayei Adam 8:9 and Kitzur 
Shulchan Aruch 7:5.

16. Shulchan Aruch Harav 46:7; Kaf Hachayim 46:49; Aruch Hashulchan 
46:13; Misgeret Hashulchan 2:2

17. Mishnah Berurah 6:14.

----------


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